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Now see, I like the idea of AI.
What I don’t like are the implications, and the current reality of AI.
I see businesses embracing AI without fully understanding the limits. Stopping the hiring juniors developers, often firing large numbers of seniors because they think AI, a group of cheap post grad vibe programmers and a handful of seasoned seniors will equal the workforce they got rid of when AI, while very good is not ready to sustain this. It is destroying the career progression for the industry and even if/when they realise it was a mistake, it might already have devastated the industry by then.
I see the large tech companies tearing through the web illegally sucking up anything they can access to pull into their ever more costly models with zero regard to the effects on the economy, the cost to the servers they are hitting, or the environment from the huge power draw creating these models requires.
It’s a nice idea, but private business cannot be trusted to do this right, we’re seeing how to do it wrong, live before our eyes.
And the whole AI industry is holding up the stock market, while AI has historically always ran the hype cycle and crashed into an AI winter. Stock markets do crash after billions pumped into a sector suddenly turn out to be not worth as much. Almost none of these AI companies run a profit and don’t have any prospect of becoming profitable. It’s when everybody starts yelling that this time it’s different that things really become dangerous.
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It’s a nice idea, but private business cannot be trusted to do this right, we’re seeing how to do it wrong, live before our eyes.
You’re right. It’s the business model driving technological advancement in the 21st century that’s flawed.
Not all AI is bad. But there’s enough widespread AI that’s helping cut jobs, spreading misinformation (or in some cases, actual propaganda), creating deepfakes, etc, that in many people’s eyes, it paints a bad picture of AI overall. I also don’t trust AI because it’s almost exclusively owned by far right billionaires.
It’s a response to the overwhelming FOMO “ngmi” shilling on every other platform.
ai is pretty bad tho
AI is bad and people who use it should feel bad.
When people say this they are usually talking about a very specific sort of generative LLM using unsupervised learning.
AI is a very broad field with great potential, the improvements in cancer screening alone could save millions of lives over the coming decades. At the core it’s just math, and the equations have been in use for almost as long as we’ve had computers. It’s no more good or bad than calculus or trigonometry.
No hope commenting like this, just get ready getting downvoted with no reason. People use wrong terms and normalize it.
Would love an explanation on how I’m in the wrong on reducing my work week from 40 hours to 15 using AI.
Existing in predatory capitalistic system and putting the blame on those who utilize available tools to reduce the predatory nature of our system is insane.
Because when your employer catches on, they’ll bring you back up to 40 anyway.
And probably because those 15 hours now produce shit quality.
My employer is pushing AI usage, if the work is done the work is done. This is the reality we’re supposed to be living in with AI, just conforming to the current predatory system because “AI bad” actively harms more than it helps.
The current predatory system will raise the limit on the 40 work week if they’re allowed to. 60. 80. You might not even get a weekend. Unions fought for your weekend.
AI does not fundamentally change this relationship. It is the same predatory system.
So cancer cell detection is now bad and those doing it should feel bad?
The world isn’t black’n white.
Me to burn victims: “You know, without fire, we couldn’t grill meat. Right? You should think more about what you say.”
???
it’s not in the least confusing lmao, you know damn well what they mean and are just acting confused as a “gotcha”
If it tries to be smart about that bad and good ai exists, then it’s a very poor take.
It actually proves my point by showing that everything is not black and white (emg AI has lots of good uses, and also lots of medium uses and also bad uses).
You also tried to put words in my mouth, that isn’t looking very smart instead of explaining what the metaphor was all about.
Don’t be obtuse, you walnut. I’m obviously not equating medical technology with 12-fingered anime girls and plagiarism.
You still mix all AI stuff in, what about hating LLMs and image generators?
So is eating meat, flying, gaming, going om holiday, basically if you exist you should feel bad
How does one feel bar?
Its true. We can have a nuanced view. Im just so fucking sick of the paid off media hyping this shit, and normies thinking its the best thing ever when they know NOTHING about it. And the absolute blind trust and corpo worship make me physically ill.
Yeah it is bad
It’s actually a real problem
Lots of pro AI astroturfing and whataboutisms in these comments… 🤢
Only because most of the people here don’t have the faintest idea what AI is or how it works.
“Anyone I disagree with must be a bot or government agent”
The reason most web forum posters hate AI is because AI is ruining web forums by polluting it with inauthentic garbage. Don’t be treating it like it’s some sort of irrational bandwagon.
But like… Good.
I mean, it is objectively bad for life. Throwing away millions to billions of gallons of water all so you can get some dubious coding advice.
Throwing away water? Does it escape into space. I completely understand the energy arguments but water?
It gets heated and then it’s unusable because the point of it is to cool things off. Some of it you can cool down and use again, by evaporation, but then you lose the amount that evaporated. When it goes back into the atmosphere it becomes polluted and you have to spend more energy cleaning it before it can be used by humans. Entropy always increases, the question is how fast you want it to increase.
Entropy always increases in closed systems. Because of the Sun, the Earth is not a closed system. If Earth were a pure entropy game, there would be no life. Also the atmosphere can’t hold infinite amount of water - that’s why it rains sometimes. So “using” fresh water is only a problem in regions where it doesn’t rain much and/or where the water has to be prepared/cleaned im the first place (which would probably make it too expensive to cool data centers in the first place) - if the water was from a natural fresh water source than just heating it is actually not a water issue - but it will contribute to global warming, but then again the argument shouldn’t be about water but about that data centers contribute to global warming.
So the amount of water is pretty much constant. And because of the huge amount of energy the Earth gets from the sun, there is plenty of opportunities for clean energy that can (and is be used) to reverse entropy. All living things reverse entropy all the time. So the issue is not using the water but the unclean energy sources that lead to global warming.
Just because water is cheap doesn’t mean it’s plentiful. We under-price water, as evidenced by the massive profiteering off of public water. These prices are inelastic and don’t respond to supply perfectly.
Also life can absolutely exist in a game of entropy. You’re pulling semantics with the closed system thing. If you want, then make the closed system be the whole solar system. It doesn’t affect my argument.
Using fresh water causes energy to be spent, that’s the whole point. Yes you can recover drinkable water from anything if you spend enough energy to do it, including the ocean, but we can’t do that as a primary means of getting water. Eventually it is a snake eating its own head with the amount of energy spent to obtain more energy.
Life can’t exist in a high entropy environment. Of course you can declare the entire solar system a closed system but because of the sun our solar system will be in an extremely low entropy state on average for a couple of billion years. Once the sun “dies” and the temperature averages out in our solar system there will be no life.
And yes it’s (almost) always an energy argument that’s why the water argument is not a good one. But not everything is an energy argument. Take He and H2 for example if you let that into the air it will eventually escape our atmosphere because of solar winds and is truly wasted/lost - but that’s not true for water. You can’t really waste water in a sense that we will have less water im the future (unless you split it into hydrogen and oxygen and let the hydrogen escape).
No one said anything about a high entropy environment. Entropy is a tool for thinking about this stuff, and it extends beyond thermodynamics as entropy is an information theory concept too. The more fragmented things become, the harder they are to work with. When you use energy (or water) for an industrial use it creates fragmentation and makes that water harder to use (especially for a different use case, drinking). You can’t just pump it back into the aquifer. This is a directional thing, not about high or low in absolute numbers.
The problem isn’t AI. The problem is Capitalism.
The problem is always Capitalism.
AI, Climate Change, rising fascism, all our problems are because of capitalism.
Can’t delete this old-ass comment because the fediverse is so free it forces me not to delete it.
Anyway, don’t care, still think the root of the problem are humans, and we will ruin whatever system is in place.
Even if lemmy users want to blindly believe switching from capitalism will be the fix to every single problem.deleted by creator
That’s a pathetic, defeatist world view. Yeah, we’re victims of our circumstances, but we can make the world a better place than what we were raised in.
You can try, and you should try. But some handful of generations ago, some assholes were in the right place at the right time and struck it rich. The ones that figured out generational wealth ended up with a disproportionate amount of power. The formula to use money to make more money was handed down, coddled, and protected to keep the rich and powerful in power. Even 100 Luigi’s wouldn’t even make the tiniest dent in the oligarch pyramid as others will just swoop in and consume their part.
Any lifelong pursuit you have to make the world a better place than you were raised in will be wiped out with a scribble of black Sharpie on Ministry of Truth letterhead.
How people dare not like the automatic bullshit machine pushed down their troat…
Seriously, genrative AI acomplishment are :
- Making mass spam easier
- Burning the planet
- Making people lose their job and not even being a decent solution
- Make all search engine and information sources worse
- Creating an economic bubble that will fuckup the economy even harder
- Easing mass surveillance and weakening privacy everywhere
One could have said many of the same thigs about a lot of new technologies.
The Internet, Nuclear, Rockets, Airplanes etc.
Any new disruptive technology comes with drawbacks and can be used for evil.
But that doesn’t mean it’s all bad, or that it doesn’t have its uses.
Give me one real world use that is worth the downside.
As dev I can already tell you it’s not coding or around code. Project get spamed with low quality nonsensical bug repport, ai generated code rarely work and doesn’t integrate well ( on top on pushing all the work on the reviewer wich is already the hardest part of coding ) and ai written documentation is ridled with errors and is not legible.
And even if ai was remotly good at something it still the equivalent of a microwave trying to replace the entire restaurant kitchen.
I can run a small LLM locally which I can talk to using voice to turn certain lights on and off, set reminders for me, play music etc.
There are MANY examples of LLM’s being useful, it has its drawbacks just like any big technology, but saying it has no uses that aren’t worth it, is ridiculous.
But we could do vocal assistants well before LLMs (look at siri) and without setting everything on fire.
And seriously, I asked for something that’s worth all the down side and you bring up clippy 2.0 ???
Where are the MANY exemples ? why are LLMs/genAI company burning money ? where are the companies making use of of the suposedly many uses ?
I genuily want to understand.
That’s like saying “asbestos has some good uses, so we should just give every household a big pile of it without any training or PPE”
Or “we know leaded gas harms people, but we think it has some good uses so we’re going to let everyone access it for basically free until someone eventually figures out what those uses might be”
It doesn’t matter that it has some good uses and that later we went “oops, maybe let’s only give it to experts to use”. The harm has already been done by eager supporters, intentional or not.
I can run a small LLM locally which I can talk to using voice to turn certain lights on and off, set reminders for me, play music etc.
Neat trick, but it’s not worth the headache of set up when you can do all that by getting off your chair and pushing buttons. Hell, you don’t even have to get off your chair! A cellphone can do all that already, and you don’t even need voice commands to do it.
Are you able to give any actual examples of a good use of an LLM?
Like it or not, that is an actual example.
I can lay in my bed and turn off the lights without touching my phone, or turn on certain muisic without touching my phone.
I could ask if I remembered to lock the front door etc.
But okay, I’ll play your game, let’s pretend that doesn’t count.
I can use my local AI to draft documents or emails speeding up the process a lot.
Or I can used it to translate.
If you want to live your life like that, go for that’s your choice. But I don’t think those applications are worth the cost of running an LLM. To be honest I find it frivolous.
I’m not against LLMs as a concept, but the way they get shoved into everything without thought and without an “AI” free option is absurd. There are good reasons why people have a knee-jerk anti-AI reaction, even if they can’t articulate it themselves.
It’s not expensive for me to run a local LLM, I just use the hardware I’m already using for gaming. Electricity is cheap and most people with a gaming PC probably use more electricity gaming than they would running their own LLM and asking it some questions.
I’m also against shoving AI in evening, and not making it Opt-In. I’m also worried about privacy and concentration of power etc.
But just outright saying LLMs are bad is rediculous.
And saying there is no good reason to use them is rediculous. Can we stop doing that.
Of those, only the internet was turned loose on an unsuspecting public, and they had decades of the faucet slowly being opened, to prepare.
Can you imagine if after WW2, Werner Von Braun came to the USA and then just like… Gave every man woman and child a rocket, with no training? Good and evil wouldn’t even come into, it’d be chaos and destruction.
Imagine if every household got a nuclear reactor to power it, but none of the people in the household got any training in how to care for it.
It’s not a matter of good and evil, it’s a matter of harm.
The Internet kind of was turned lose on an unsuspecting public. Social media has and still is causing a lot of harm.
Did you really compare every household having a nuclear reactor with people having access to AI?
How’s is that even remotely a fair comparison.
To me the Internet being released on people and AI being released on people is more of a fair comparison.
Both can do lots of harm and good, both will probably cost a lot of people their jobs etc.
We should ban computers since they are making mass surveillance easier. /s
we should allow lead in paint its easier to use /s
You are deliberatly missing my point which is : gen AI as an enormous amount of downside and no real world use.
Yes. AI can be used for spam, job cuts, and creepy surveillance, no argument there, but pretending it’s nothing more than a corporate scam machine is just lazy cynicism. This same “automatic BS” is helping discover life-saving drugs, diagnosing cancers earlier than some doctors, giving deaf people real-time conversations through instant transcription, translating entire languages on the fly, mapping wildfire and flood zones so first responders know exactly where to go, accelerating scientific breakthroughs from climate modeling to space exploration, and cutting out the kind of tedious grunt work that wastes millions of human hours a day. The problem isn’t that AI exists, it’s that a lot of powerful people use it selfishly and irresponsibly. Blaming the tech instead of demanding better governance is like blaming the printing press for bad propaganda.
Arent those different types of AI?
I dont think anyone hating AI is referring to the code that makes enemies move, or sort things into categories
LLMs aren’t artificial intelligence in any way.
They’re extremely complex and very smart prediction engines.
The term artificial intelligence has been co-opted in hijacked for marketing purposes a long time ago.
The kind of AI that in general people expect to see is a fully autonomous self-aware machine.
If anyone has used any llm for any extended period of time they will know immediately that they’re not that smart even chatgpt arguably the smartest of them all is still highly incapable.
What we do have to come to terms with is that these llms do have an application they have function and they are useful and they can be used in a deleterious way just like any technology at all.
If a program that can predict prices for video games based on reviews and how many people bought it can be called AI long before 2021, LLMs can too
This same “automatic BS” is helping discover life-saving drugs, diagnosing cancers earlier than some doctors
Not the same kind of AI. At all. Generative AI vendors love this motte-and-bailey.
That’s not a motte-and-bailey.
Yes, any further questions?
Whether intentional or not, this is gaslighting. “Here’s the trendy reaction those wacky lemmings are currently upvoting!”
Getting to the core issue, of course we’re sick of AI, and have a negative opinion of it! It’s being forced into every product, whether it makes sense or not. It’s literally taking developer jobs, then doing worse. It’s burning fossil fuels and VC money and then hallucinating nonsense, but still it’s being jammed down our throats when the vast majority of us see no use-case or benefit from it. But feel free to roll your eyes at those acknowledging the truth…
