I understand that some of the criticism comes from conservatives but the sentiment seems to extend far beyond thst. Of course, I understand it when it’s forced or when someone only does it to survive against their will. But if people genuinely want to do it, why do people hate on them?
- giving fake hope to subsribers
- generating fake drama
- used for tax fraud in many cases
I don’t I love their work \s
Rape is worse than beating, because sex is a uniquely intimate activity. The intimacy is what makes the commercialization of sex so fragile. The chances of sex work and porn turning out sustainably healthy are so narrow.
Magical thinking bullshit. Sex is exactly as sacred as a one on one game of basketball, and almost every bit of the Patriarchy rests on the foundation of denying that basic truth.
I’m all for smashing patriarchy and a part of me agrees with you on sex being “just another activity”. But I’d be very interested to hear other people’s thoughts on my argument about rape vs beating!
Ice cream is delicious because it is sweet.
It is possible to state something that is both completely correct and totally wrong at the same time. Your statement is exactly that.
my issue…
they are just ads with tits. (yes, I’m being blunt). they come into social settings and post images or whatever, and it’s just yo… you with the penis. give me money because I have tits.
overall, I have no issue with the site. but FFS … STAY ON THAT SITE. don’t come here and advertise your ass cheese. its annoying and the majority dgaf.
this applies to onlyfans because pornstars… well they don’t do that shit. they keep their crap to normal ads (which still suck) and their sites. I have respect for pornstars, I have no respect for onlyfans ‘gimmie money’ clowns
tell me you hate women without telling me you hate women
re-reading what you actually replied too.
shut up, you’re an absolute twat
Ass cheese? Link?
Bro has failed to consider male sex work, or sex work not aimed at people with penises.
In all seriousness this is giving big “I’m OK with gays but can they just not shove it in my face?” energy. Reevaluate how your phrase this argument.
Apparently one of the reasons for advertising off-site is because OF does not have an on-site discovery mechanism. So there really aren’t other options. Not the fault of the performers.
Huh. I would have guessed that they would try to get consumers to subscribe to as many providers as possible and constantly suggest new ones (social media style)
Reducing people to objects is generally bad.
Only fans also promote sexualization of girls/teens.
It’s well established in social research that the patriarchy uses sexual objectification of women to help keep them reduced as second class citizens.
It helps promote the idea that “women want to be sexually assaulted and they like sexual harassment”.
Taking blame from the predators.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Objectification
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-objectification
Additionally. Turning intimacy and affection into something to be sold or bought devalues this aspect of human connection.
https://www.thorn.org/research/library/commodified-online-sexual-interactions/
Consent and Commodification: Objections to the Market for Sex Work https://pressbooks.lib.vt.edu/pper/chapter/article-4/
I personally think sex work should be decriminalized for the prostitute but not the johns.
Sex work is not something people do because its a choice but out of need for finances.
Meaning it’s a form of coercion and exploitation.
You could argue most work/labor is that. It is. I won’t say its not.
But sex work perpetuates harm more (physical, mental and promotes misogyny in our society) and specifically harms women the most. Though it harms anyone working in that industry.
For real
Sex work is not something people do because its a choice but out of need for finances.
This may be true in many or most cases but I’ve met sex workers who like their job and want to keep doing it because it’s an easy and fun way to make a lot of money.
Easy money. So finances?
Self objectification is also a problem in our society.
Do you remember how women athletes used to say all the time how it was empowering to be naked in the swimsuit sports illustrated magazine.
?Our culture has convinced women that their greatest value is being sexy and getting sexual attention and unfortunately a lot of younger women believe this.
They don’t realize that this mindset and acceptance of these values promote the very system that harms them and others.
Easier money than doing other work. They could make ends meet other ways, I’m sure, but this is easier and more fun.
Like, I could make ends meet as a roofer but making more money for sitting in front of a computer is easier and more fun.
As for the other stuff, all I can say is that they weren’t all women.
I think you are really downplaying the risks here. I have friends who have done sex work. It’s incredibly dangerous. Men may hurt you. They may stalk you. They may give you a std.
Sometimes the woman agrees to a specific service and the man forces her to do something she said she didn’t want to do.It’s not like they can go to the police.
Police will just say “well that’s what you get for being a whore”.
Trans women in sex work have even higher rates of violence and murder.
Men (usually young) are also subjected to the same risks as women.
Also just because it’s easy doesn’t mean it’s the best long term option
I mean most of the problems in this world are caused by people wanting things the easy way even it makes things harder later.
Which is why every one of them supported making sex work legal so they have those protections.
How does making sex work legal help a 40 year old with no skills or job experience?
Decriminalizing sex work is much more effective at reducing crime on the sex workers.
If you don’t believe me, look into the Netherlands.
They have a huge problem with sex trafficking because it’s legal to sell sex there.
It doesn’t protect anyone. It encourages sex trafficking and pimping. Especially for foreign victims and young girls.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_trafficking_in_the_Netherlands
In 2017, it was estimated by the Dutch National Rapporteur on Trafficking in Human Beings and Sexual Violence against Children that more than 6,000 people in the Netherlands fall victim to human trafficking each year.[6][7] Two thirds of the people trafficked, about 4,000 people per year, fall victim to sexual slavery and abuse.[6] This group consisted largely of Dutch women, including minors (1,320 girls each year) who were preyed upon by so-called “lover boys”.[7] The other 2,000 victims of human trafficking were largely foreigners who were put to work by organized crime groups.[6]
I know it sounds like legalizing it would help sex workers. But the reality is that it doesn’t.
Objectification of bodies never leads to good ends.
https://eclj.org/geopolitics/eu/legal-prostitution-and-human-trafficking-in-the-netherlands?lng=en
How about instead we invest in free education and job training and pay people a living wage so that the dangerous sex work isn’t their best option for survival.
think you are really downplaying the risks here. I have friends who have done sex work.
As do I. Friends and family both. And I have never heard a sex worker say any of the things you ascribe to them.
Do sex work in your 20s instead of developing a career. Then when you are too old and 40 with no job prospects and no skills, and no one wants you. What then ?
I’m wondering if you actually know that many people in the industry. Bcs I’m middle aged, everyone I know who does SW is close to my age, so they’re all 35+, mostly over 40, and doing fine.
But if that weren’t the case, the same question can be asked of anyone doing manual labor, once your body breaks down (which happens a lot earlier for manual laborers), what do you do?
To borrow an old quote: If you think that the prostitute sells her body and the coal miner does not, your view of labor is clouded by your puritanical view of sex.
Okay so you don’t actually know anyone who has aged out of sex work .
My “puritanical views”. Is this a joke?
My stance is I’m against human trafficking. I’m against pimps. I’m against workers being hurt by johns. I’m against the promotion of misogyny and objectification of people. I’m against capitalism turning human connection into just another thing to exploit for money. I’m especially against the harms it perpetuates in society.
And I’m against people resorting to the high risk sex work because it’s the easy choice when there should be better options for people.
People have more value that tits and ass. Or a hole.
They actually do.
You can pretend the risks and statistics I gave you aren’t real.
It doesn’t make them false.
Also I certainly don’t appreciate your strawman what-aboutism argument.
We aren’t talking about people who do labor jobs. We are talking about sex workers.
Jesus. How can you possibly believe that sex work is good for women. I mean. Seriously. How fucked up is it to believe that ?
Why would you support the systems that harm women the most. Why. ? Do you hate women ? I can’t see why anyone would think sex work is a great career opportunity for women except people like Epstein and trump.
Cause those are the types of people that benefit from women being exploited this way.
Okay so you don’t actually know anyone who has aged out of sex work .
And obviously neither do you. But I do know men women and enbys still doing and enjoying sex work at the age you specifically picked as the age where they “can’t” do it anymore and their life will be over for having done sex work. Which was my point, and one you’ve utterly failed to engage with since you now know you were very wrong.
My “puritanical views”. Is this a joke?
No, it’s a quote, and I apparently misremembered it, since the original word was “moralistic” not “puritanical”.
To be clear: sex work is as bad as any other form of labor coerced by capitalism, it just isn’t worse than any other form of labor coerced by capitalism. Only the kind of magical thinking that says sex is some special sphere of human activity that should be considered sacred would ever tell you otherwise.
And the pimps, Epsteins, and human traffickers of the world benefit directly from moralistic views of sex. If we treated sex exactly the same as any other full contact sport, there would be far less danger for sex workers who report bad behavior from clients or employers, and there would be far less demand from creeps who want to buy children, because there is a definite correlation (even if no proven causal link) between heavily moralistic views of sex and CSA. This is why religious leaders so often wind up being child rapists.
Finally if you think there’s anything strawman or whataboutism in comparing sex work to any other form of work under capitalism, then you do not understand the point I’m making at all, which is that there is no moral difference between the sex worker and the coal miner in a capitalist society. In a socialist society there’s a discussion to be had about whether sex work is socially necessary labor, but there is no question it is labor.
This is getting too close to denying women agency for my liking.
Protecting women from trafficking and pimps is denying them agency?
I specifically said I’m against criminalizing sex workers.
This is akin to denying critical race theory.
Stop and think about who benefits. It literally is the Epsteins of this world benefiting from this glamorized false narrative about how sex work is.
I would never hold it against a women for choosing sex work. What I do have a problem with is the systems that have made sure she doesn’t have any better options.
These false narratives that it’s empowering.
And the men in power who push this narrative that her only value is whatever they like about the way she looks.
If there was a basic income there would be a lot less people in the porn industry. There still would be people in the porn industry though because those ones enjoy the work.
Because most cultures have been heavily influenced by cultures descended from the bronze age sheep fuckers who came up with the idea of virginity as a way of ensuring paternity and maximizing the price they could charge for selling their preteen daughters to old men.
@Fedpie porn addiction is a serious problem for society, and porn models are just a part of it
So long as it’s entirely consensual for all who’s involved and every one is of adult age I don’t see the problem …
The problem is that under capitalism very little labor is entirely voluntary. Most people have to take the job they get, almost no one does sex work voluntarily.
Sex work is work.If someone hates on a sex workers, me thinks they doth protest too much.
I have no problem with them doing it, I just probably would never date anyone who has had an only fans. It’s something young women/men should be aware of that they automatically exclude themselves from a huge part of the dating pool when they make a decision like that. If they are ok with that, more power to them! Kind of like having 30+ sexual partners. It seems to take pieces of your soul, and it takes decades of work to get those pieces back together in my opinion. Most people are inherently turned off by that for a reason.
Kind of like having 30+ sexual partners. It seems to take pieces of your soul, and it takes decades of work to get those pieces back together in my opinion
your opinion isn’t worth anything because it appeals to vague spiritual vibes instead of actual reasoning
Most people are inherently turned off by that for a reason.
only insecure misogynist weirdos care about that body count shit.
It’s something young women/men should be aware of that they automatically exclude themselves from a huge part of the dating pool when they make a decision like that.
And nothing of value is lost. Who wants to date someone with weird moralistic hangups about sex, unless they share those hangups?
It’s hard to predict who you will fall for in 2,5, or 10 years. You will want to be honest with that person, and it might turn them off to know your history. Luckily, after enough time has passed, and you’ve really worked on yourself, it shouldn’t really matter what you did 10-20 years ago.
In my opinion, you are better off finding yourself a consistent fuck-buddy for in between relationships. A mutual arrangement, rather than a bunch of one night stands, is much safer for your mental health (assuming no one catches feelings).
lmao
I don’t care for ads. They are basically living ads.
Sex is still seen as a Taboo. It’s 2026 guys, come on!
You say that, but outside of Europe, I’m fairly sure much of society is getting less permissive since the 60s.
It can only get worse!
Of course, I understand it when it’s forced or when someone only does it to survive against their will. But if people genuinely want to do it, why do people hate on them?
Replace ‘porn star’ with ‘slave’ and you’ll understand. There might be a section of the population that would like to be a slave, but we have, as a society, decided that people shouldn’t be bought and sold like furniture.
Of course, the hatred should be aimed at the economic and social systems that allow people to buy others’ dignity, not at the victims of that system.
There are infinitely more people who work themselves to death in hazardous jobs for peanuts with a boss who treats them like shit.
But somehow the people who are their own boss, make good money on their own terms have no dignity and are ‘sold like furniture’.
That is a backward and pedantic view.Having spoken with a few women that have done things adjacent to pornography, their regrets are mostly in regards to the way they were treated by people that were not in the industry. The escorts I’ve spoken with enjoy the work itself, although not necessarily all of the customers.
What you’re saying about the horrors of pornography and prostitution apply to ALL people that need to work for a living. The company I work for buys my time, the product of my labor–which they sell for many times what I’m paid–and even my dignity by forcing me to wear a uniform of their choice. I absolutely do not like the customers that ultimately purchase the products of my labor, but I have little choice if I want to have a place to live, and food to eat.
The escorts I’ve spoken with enjoy the work itself
Like I said, I’m sure there are people who enjoy this, but the system is still exploitative and harmful.
What you’re saying about the horrors of pornography and prostitution apply to ALL people that need to work for a living …
Yes. In an ideal world, people won’t have to do any dangerous or difficult jobs. But for now, we can’t start with the worst offenders.
I think there are no worst offenders here, all labor is valid as in all labor is exploitative in a capitalist system
Dignity is very relative here, I think you can be a sex worker and keep your dignity
I think there are no worst offenders here, all labor is valid as in all labor is exploitative in a capitalist system
There is no difference in work quality between painting and coal mining? Teaching children and soldering diodes? Really?
I think you can be a sex worker and keep your dignity
Again, I’m not talking about the exceptions here. Having to sell yourself for money is a horrible fate to most, to the extent that we make laws against that. You can think of this the same way.
Having to sell yourself for money is what most people do every day, bruh. Every job I’ve ever had has been a major detriment to my physical and/or mental health, and was accepted only under threat of homelessness and starvation.
I’ve met more people who are proud sex workers then I have people who are proud fast food employees.
I think that perhaps you are letting your disgust for a person’s work color how you feel about the person. Do you feel the same about athletes and actors? They also “sell their bodies”.
Yes. In an ideal world, people won’t have to do any dangerous or difficult jobs. But for now, we can’t start with the worst offenders.
do you believe that all sex work is dangerous or difficult?
do you believe that easy & safe but compulsory work as a means to get obtain food and shelter is an ideal world?
do you believe that all sex work is dangerous or difficult?
Emotional toll aside, putting yourself at the mercy of a stronger person who has already shown that he does not care about right and wrong, day after day, is very much dangerous.
do you believe that easy & safe but compulsory work as a means to get obtain food and shelter is an ideal world?
People do enjoy work when it is pleasant and interesting. Should it be compulsory? I don’t know. Rich people who don’t have to do any work often lose touch with the world. So perhaps even in that ideal world where we have amazing robots that can do anything, we should have people do a little bit of some work of their choice.
But all this is just speculation. For now, the focus should be on freeing people from the most dangerous and difficult jobs.
No, you misunderstand: ALL labor under capitalism is exploitative. ‘Dangerous’ and ‘difficult’ has nothing to do with it. The system is set up so that your labor must be used for the benefit of someone else in order to obtain the bare necessities of survival, and you don’t get the full value of your labor. It doesn’t matter if that’s working in an office doing spreadsheets all day, or as a sex work; ALL labor is exploited under capitalism.
Work is work; sex workers are workers.
See my reply to sakuraba@lemmy.ml.
There are significant differences to being forced to sell your mind, competence and time; vs being forced to auction off the another’s use of your own genitals.
Yes, being forced to sell your own mind is infinitely worse. You no longer have your own thoughts; your mind belongs to your employers. That is absolutely, 1000% worse than selling physical labor.
Please explain what those differences are without using any magical thinking that places sex into a sacred sphere of human activity that is holy and sacrosanct?
Or don’t. My point is you can tell how serious a person is when they start talking about the morality of sex by replacing every mention of sex in their point with “boxing”. It’s still a highly physical one-on-one activity that’s a crime of both participants haven’t consented, so if the exact same argument doesn’t make sense when made about boxing then they are thinking magically about sex and not materialistically.
Why do I have to think about sex materialistically?
Because thinking about it magically leads you to idiotic conclusions like “maybe the bronze age goat fuckers really did discover the ultimate truth of sexual morality, and it’s just coincidence that it just so happened to lay the foundation for millennia of Patriarchal bullshit”.
So you have arbitrarily decided that I must think about sex either magically or materialistically.
Good day to you sir.
I mean, I didn’t decide that, that’s just kind of how it works.
Are you comparing OnlyFans to literal slavery? You do know that they get paid, right?
Slaves could get paid and buy their freedom in many historical societies.
I think the comparison is about want and need. They do it because they feel forced into it, by some means or another.
Sounds like the same reason I go to work. I need the money because it’s the only legal option I have to obtain food and shelter.
Not most of them, apparently!
I respect sex workers but I really don’t want to be advertised to while I’m jerking off, or ever really. Like if i’m in the market for buying nudes I’ll come to you. I have nothing against anyone who buys or sells pics on onlyfans.
how do find these people if they can’t market themselves? (honest question)
