What is a man? A miserable pile of…

Sorry, wrong thread😜😁

I would answer what’s a biological male?and at which point you’re one anymore?

The question feels already hard to answer, and I am not sure there is a consensus on it.

It would depend on the context. The response depends on who is asking, their openness to learn and the reason for the statement. In isolation, it appears inflammatory rather than factual. It can be both.

1. “Biologically fe/male” is a pseudoscientific term created to delegitimize trans individuals, so

2. It does not matter

3. see above

4. It’s intended to be a contradiction, an insidious doubt or caveat that delegitimizes the declaration that trans individuals are who they say they are.

Don’t fall for it. Don’t perpetuate it. Delete this post, is my advice.

I wouldn’t engage in discussion with people saying that. Nothing good can come from it, and they probably aren’t people worth spending time with.

Because this feels like a loaded statement, I’d respond like this: Biology makes mistakes. Biology is fallible. To frame this about biology is not sufficiently complex to address the issue.

1. Talk to experts.
2. The initial statement seems to me is that of a culture warrior, not a curious mind. Therefore it doesn’t matter to me.
3. Compassion doesn’t require logic. But if you want sonething slightly logical: I don’t understand quantum physics either. I’m reliably informed it exists. Me being unable to grasp the uncertainty principle leaves me feeling uneasy and frustrated. Others may feel in a comparable way about gender identity. It’s okay to admit that you don’t get it. I don’t fully understand it either. It’s not okay to be an asshole about it.
4. Apples to rotten pears.

I would say that is comparing personal identity to a medical definition, two independent and separate concepts.

Personally, I look at people pointing this out like I look at people that feel the need to point out to others that a woman has breast implants. It’s her choice to do what she wants to her own body and pointing it out makes you look like a rude asshole.

Biological sex (male, female, intersex) refers to the physical aspects of your body, such as primary sex characteristics (reproductive organs), secondary sex characteristics (body hair, breasts, fat distribution, etc), hormone levels (estrogen, testosterone), and chromosomes.

Gender (man, woman, nonbinary, other terms) is more about an internal sense of self, how you see yourself and how you want your body to be, as well as what social category you belong in.

A trans woman is a person who was biologically male at birth, but sees herself as a woman/wants her body to align with her gender (woman). Not all trans women medically transition, and that’s ok, but for those who do, it can change various aspects of their biological sex, such as hormone levels and secondary sex characteristics, so it may not be entirely true to say that trans women (post transition) are biologically male either.

There are many different perspectives on this. I subscribe to the old Judith Butler perspective that sex=gender and they are both a social construct.

1. No, biological gender is not in the sphere of facts. Chromosomes, genitalia, hormones and biology in general are in the realm of facts. Lumping them together into the category “sex” is social construction and not scientific (at least not part of natural science).
2. I don’t think it is.
3. Trans women are simply women who were not designated as such at birth. No need to mix in biology. Therefore no contradiction.

Are eunuchs biologically agender?

Are intersex people with chimerism or cryptorchidism biologically two genders at once?

Are women who have had hysterectomies biologically male?

The answer to all of the above is, and I say this with all the respect in the world, a resounding ‘no.’

1. Typically, but not always. Some trans women are biologically intersex. (This also depends on how you define “biologically male” which is not totally straightforward.)
2. It matters in some contexts, not in others. Their physician should know, because various hormone treatments cause different effects in people’s bodies, and certain health conditions effect biologically male or female people differently too. That’s nobody else’s business but the patient and their trusted medical providers. As far as their dignity, opportunities, and general acceptance, it doesn’t matter. Trans folks deserve the exact same rights, opportunities, and acceptance as anybody else.
3. Usually people who bring this up aren’t acting in good faith, so I don’t engage with them. On the rare occasion where somebody is genuinely curious and wants to learn, I answer them in the same way as I am doing right now.
4. Because the word “woman” denotes multiple concepts, like the word “parent”. If a child is adopted at birth and is raised by a couple, the child and their community will refer to those people as the child’s parents. This is not a false statement, because the word “parent” doesn’t only mean the direct biological progenitors of a person. Parent also is a social role, hence the verb form “to parent somebody.” This is also why we have the terms, “biological parent” and “adoptive parent” to add additional information when it’s necessary.

Trans women are women in the sense that they are filling their society’s sociological role that surrounds the expected concept of a woman. That will be different depending on many factors, and will have many different aspects including their pronouns, fashion and clothing, voice, makeup, hair, activities, and so forth.

Just like any other woman, they will chose which social roles they desire to fit into, and which ones they don’t, and all of that is completely acceptable.

of course it’s definitionally correct, if a trans woman was female she’d be a cis woman

It’s extremely hairy to define biological sex. Whoever wants to argue has a middle school level understanding of biology and completely ignores the science.

See

“You’re biologically a loser lmao”