I should play this. I bought it, after all.
Me too
Oh man, VGCats. I remember those days.
A reminder of a bygone era. Remember when we thought the video game industry was a mess back then?
I played the first game way, way back. At the very least, I remember completing it, and liking it. So fast forward several years, the game goes on sale plenty, and I’ve forgotten nearly all of it, but remembered I liked it. So why not play it again, right? Picked it up for cheap, and just could not get into it. I tried a couple times even, but I just can’t for some reason.
Dishonored is one of the few games that I’ve turned right around and played through again after I beat it. The gameplay is just so free. It’s not really the biggest map ever, but it is so dense and easy to navigate. I also haven’t experienced a lot of titles that just ooze atmosphere the way that Dishonored does. The art direction is off the charts, and I think it’s aged pretty impeccably. It’s always a good idea to do stylized over realistic, at least if you want your game to stand the test of time.
I think I’m the only person who played through the entire game and didn’t like it. Yes, yes, I should probably have quit but I’m a bit of an optimist and hoped it would get better.
It felt to me like the game really didn’t want me to kill anyone. However it had any number of fun ways to kill people and then scolded me when I was naughty enough to (gasp) use them!
Also the rats were bizarrely low poly compared to everything else. Odd gripe, perhaps, but given how crucial they are to the setting it felt strangely shit.
It was unfortunately a product of its time where moral systems ultimately amounted to binary good guy/bad guy outcomes which was the style at the time. The system was designed to make you want to play it twice. If you’re used to the more modern moral ambiguity in today’s RPGs I don’t think anyone can blame you for disliking it.
I grew up playing Fallout 1/2, Deus Ex, stuff like that. Dishonored framed its morality system as “chaos” rather than good vs. bad but ultimately I had characters complaining about my methods. You brought in someone to specifically be an assassin and then you’re outraged that he kills people? I shot the damn traiterous boatman in the head at the end of the game.
Well an assassin kills his targets. He doesn’t kill every innocent bystander he sees. In the first game, the guard enemies you see are your colleagues who are fully under the impression that you are a traitor who killed the empress. They are functionally your enemies during the game, but they are ultimately the good guys.
The rebel leaders, especially the admiral are going to complain about you killing who are also basically his men.
IIRC you still get the low-chaos ending if you only kill the targets. It’s just by going wild and killing everyone that you get high-chaos, and I think this fits in the moral framing of the game.
I do agree with your gripe that D1 gives you a lot of fun ways to kill people and challenges you not to use them, while at the same time giving you very little nonlethal tools. They addressed this well in the sequel IMO, but I did also love the challenge and the temptation knowing that these enemies would be so easy to defeat with a rat swarm but I just shouldn’t. Like I said, keeps with the moral framing about the slippery slope of mindless revenge IMO
Playing as Emily in 2 is really fun. You have the option to ignore stealth, go all out with your powers, and still not kill anyone.
I’m reminded of a show I was watching and lampshading. One of the characters is exhausting to watch and the other characters comment on how much the character sucks. That’s great an’ all but I’m still stuck watching this character suck. Commenting on it doesn’t make it go away.
Similarly I could not use the tools the game gives me but they’re there for me to use. If I’m not supposed to use them then I might as well instead play something that wants me to play it!
I understand what you’re saying (I think) but you know that… you can kill everyone, right? The worst the game does is throw a few more enemies at you (to kill) and some moral characters say mean things to you. Pretty standard RPG mechanics, IMO. It’s just a choice and like I said, the narrative framing sets you up to be a highly-trained stealthy assassin, not some mass-murdering juggernaut. But you can do that if you want
Similarly I could not use the tools the game gives me
Offers* you. There’s even an achievement for completing the game with just a sword and pistol, no upgrades or powers ;) Choices!!
Much like in Spec Ops: The Line the player can just stop playing. I mean, you’re not wrong, but it seems silly to me.
Some games handle this by making it the ultra-violent approach essentially non-viable but that’s not how Dishonored decided to roll.
the narrative framing sets you up to be a highly-trained stealthy assassin
I quietly took out guards rather than avoiding them. No alarms were raised, etc… Seems pretty stealthy to me.
Ultimately I just didn’t appreciate the mixed messaging of “here are tools for extreme violence” and “why did you commit extreme violence?”. If non-lethal means were such a priority why was I given tools that heavily favour lethality?
You’re really not getting this lol
In what way do you think the game scolded you for killing enemies?
Whilst it’s been twelve years I remember returning to the between mission hub and characters literally complaining. The boatman in particular.
That’s true, it is a game where each choice has a direct consequence. Going along that train of thought, do you see the “star system” in GTA as the game scolding you for your choices? If you’ve never played it, in GTA you are a criminal and as you commit crimes you get a star rating. The more stars means the more law enforcement that attempts to subdue or kill you. There really isn’t a way to complete the game in a non-violent manner though.
A better equivalent would be a GTA game giving you a mission with a tank and then the mission givers seriously, not for comedy, giving the player shit for doing anything but driving on the road avoiding all cars.
My problem is with the tonal dissonance of giving the player weapons designed to be fun only for the game to complain when they’re used.
The opposite being a Bond game. Really he should only be using sneaky spy weapons but he’s given a ridiculous arsenal and expected to use it. If you give me a machine gun then why would you expect me not to use it?
Anyone ever watch stealthgamerBR dishonored videos? Freaking rad AF
Mhm. Can’t say I enjoyed Dishonored much, myself. I prefer Thief 1-3, probably because they are slower paced and have less combat.
All instances of combat in Dishonored are completely optional in Dishonored. It’s actually one of the built in challenges of the game that you are rewarded for. Beating the game with out ever being seen is called Ghost and beating it with zero kills is called Pacifist.
Top it off by not using powers either, most enjoyable playthrough I’ve had.
Mostly flesh and steel! I loved the added challenge of that and how it made me rethink my comfortable routes.
In Dishonored 2 you can reject the Outsider entirely and do a zero powers run. That one is fittingly called “Only flesh and steel”.
I consider this game a classic
Dishonored nailed a neat trick: If every game dev stops innovating immediately after you release an innovative game, your game will always be considered highly innovative.
Yeah, people are always like, y no half life 3?
Look at what Valve has said in response to similar questions.
Its basically a polite way of saying ‘yeah there really isn’t a better possible first person shooter, single player experience.’
So they made a reality breaking first person puzzle game, became the de facto overlords of PC gaming platforms, invented VR tech, oh and made linux be able to run every game, oh and we make console-esque PCs now too, I guess.
Hell, I don’t even know of other games that solve the ‘multiplayer fps maps are predictable and boring’ the way L4D did, where the map itself csn basically mutate, have a bunch of semi-procedural preset variants.
Nope, instead, we still have the most popular multiplayer FPS games have basically static, memorizable maps.
Turns out gamers broadly don’t actually seem to want innovation, they seem to want gacha games, as gacha games are now basically more than half of the gaming market.
Example of that: That friend you know who’s still really trying to convince you that Fallout 76 is better now.
I was with you until your last sentence.
Fallout 76 is better now. The monetizing is little ew, but there are lots of content and they fixed a lot of the big caveats i had with the game.
Id put that game just under a Noman sky and Cyperpunk 2077 as a game that turned around.
Also valve did not origaninally make portal. Its roots came from Kim Swifts senior project. Valve gave resurces to add the shine, but the concept did not originate from Valves offices.
They did not invent vr stuff either. First vr stuff crude as it was comes allthe way from the 60’s in the 90’s Sega had their Sega vr in some arcade racings games and oculus rift from Carmack + team was first modern style vr set on the markets.
Lots of games use similar mechanics than left for dead to make the maps and spawns feel different.
Here few from the top of my head: Vermintide 2 (maybe 1, havent played that) Pay day 2 Back 4 blood Ane could argue Alien isolation is similar because it has same kind of game director controlling the game. Remnant 1 & 2 Gunfire reborn.
- games like Helldives 1 & 2 and deep rock galactica where the whole map is generated.
One could argue even most extraction shootters do that because the exctraction zones change place.
Yeah all wants just catcha games. Thats why games like Clair Obscur, Death Stranding and now Dispatch have done so poorly.
Sucking on todds dick must feel good to you eh bootlicker.
You think one of the most popular and best-rated games of 2025 “did poorly?”
Sorry. I forgot the /s
Oh damn lol that was some serious commitment to the bit
Ok uh, what can you do, in terms of actual gameplay mechanics, in Fallout76, that you can’t do in… basically every multiplayer, survival/craft/open world/fps game?
There are so many of those… and… FO76 basically came out around the tail end of the kind of craze for those kinds of games, they were trend chasing.
Uh lets see, Valve did make Portal, what happened was they saw a demo of a game (Narbacular Drop) being concepted at a nearby gaming college expo, and they basically hired all of them, taught them Source, gave them more team breadth and depth to work with.
Valve has… or had… a track record of doing this, in the 90s / 00s. Oh, thats a neat mod for our game: Hire them.
So yes, Valve did originally make Portal. By seeing a neat concept demo, hiring the people behind it, and then making Portal.
I mean, you can say that after 5 more years of development, F076 became a basically functional open world survival craft fps, sure, but like…
No Mans Sky basically revolutionized the concept of what you can do with procedural generation, oh and, they just kept adding more and more stuff, just to the base game, not as DLC, not as MTX.
CP77? Yeah very rough start, but uh, entirely different scope of production value, being an actually competent RPG that’s practically an ImSim in many ways, all with an absurd level of graphical fidelity.
Like, everyone just expected that game to be Grand Theft Auto 5, Cyberpunk Edition, started their standards there, and then got mad that it wasn’t at parity.
CD Projekt Red was a AA studio when they were making this.
They were not Rockstar. They were not Bethesda.
Ok, I’ll give you that PayDay2 does actually have similar map mutating dynamics, I also have not played Vermintide, we do not speak of Back 4 Blood, what an embarassment, I am also unfamiliar with Remnant.
What I was trying to get at is … map mutations is how you solve the age old FPS team v team problem of… if you just have better map knowledge, you tend to win, so this causes a problem where you either have to keep pumping out new maps to keep things fresh, or you have to have a bunch of other balancing gameplay mechanics to have variety from there.
But the fundamental problem is that vets will clown noobs all the time, often by just simply having the maps memorized, angles and positions figured out, etc.
Also Alien Isolation has pretty good monster AI that works with the rest of the game design, but no, thats not mutating maps.
Open world maps that move objective markers around are not mutating maps.
HellDivers 2 is a good example of doing proc gen maps… but again, thats an extraction shooter, co-op shooter type thing.
Nobody, that I am aware of, has pulled this off for mass PvP battles, like, 16-32+ vs 16-32+ players.
As for Valve not literally, technically, totally inventing VR… sure yeah ok, what I meant was they poured tons of their own resources into doing VR in their own way, they’re one of the only teams that’s made an actual AAA VR game that fully embraces the concept of ‘you are a person in another world, a world that has high graphical realism.’
Virtual reality.
The point there was they turned toward innovating in other areas, that they did more or less start from scratch and invent their own concept of VR.
Your final quip about gacha games is funny.
Just look at the numbers dude, the vast majority of money to be made in gaming is by selling MTX addiction simulators.
That’s not to say there are not still people who really do actually want well crafted, truly innovative or very well put together, fully fledged games… but the way the math of capitalism works on that is uh, those kinds of endeavors are way riskier, and have way worse ROI, than selling waifus to dorks.
I hope that actual games defeat waifu simulators, we are seeing a lot of AAAs crash and burn recently, but uh, I don’t think gacha games are going anywhere… and most of the outfits with the money to be able to undertake a truly groundbreaking project?
Theyre all incompotent morons at the management level, who, after failing hard at their attempts in the last 5 ish years, are now just gonna try and hand that all over to AI, to attempt to further increase ROI.
But, normies love ‘recognizable brand franchise’, normies consistently auto-hypetrain and nostalgia-bate themselves, normies prove that having more than half a game’s budget be marketing does brainwash them very well.
Here, I’ll end with another hot take:
If, after everything that happened with Bethesda, up to the point of Starfield releasing…
You still bought Starfield on day one, or pre-ordered it?
You’re the problem, you’re the normie, you’re the person marketing and nostalgia work on, you didn’t realize your in an abusive, parasocial relationship with Bethesda.
Remember, no pre-orders.
The friend 👆
Okay one thing I have definately noticed in L4d is that I am never stationary or still long enough to feel bored. Almost every other fps pve game is just “stand on top of hill and gun down hordes of zombies”.
Modern games feel like we are going backwards in gameplay. Atleast the graphics are nice I guess?
They really did go very in depth to the ‘game controller’, basically its a simulated DM for a TTRPG.
The … constantly on edge thing?
Systems of spawning and nudging AI states of groups of enemies, specifically designed to make you feel that near constant tension.
That, combined with the entire group alerting/hording npc mechanic. Make a little noise? You might be ok. Make too much noise? Prepare to get fucked. Oh also, the threshold between ‘probably safe’ and ‘totally fucked’ is always moving around a bit, so… you don’t really ever know where it is, with certainty.
Its basically an optimal way to induce a stress/panic disorder in a person, its not you watching a horror movie, its… you’re essentially actually in one.
The other element of that is that they’re much better at traditional map design, making choke points mixed with more open spaces, giving you some options to explore/use as cover/retreat to, but also, some of those options are actually traps that will punish you.
Ooops, that’s not safety, its effectively a monster closet!
(Sometimes its an actual monster closet, sometimes its that the closet is actually fairly far away, but there’s a prebaked navmesh path from the actual spawn point that leads directly to thst area you thought was gonna be safe.)
Also uh L4D doesn’t have a 2D minimap.
It uses things like way points and object/objective stencils/borders, and, a lot of the maps are complex vertically, in addition to horizontally, so… just naively moving toward the waypoint?
Probably not gonna work so well in L4D, whereas in most games, that basically will work.
There is also a kind of problem in that a growing number of people cannot navigate their own hometowns without a real life minimap… players generally are getting worse at complex environment navigation overtime, and that’s true in both real and virtual spaces.
Half Life 2 was about 5 years too early to be considered “basically beyond imptovement”. The graphics are a little dated now, and maybe the gameplay is a little simpler than a modern FPS, but ultimately it’s pretty close to the mark. I haven’t been surprised by FPS mechanics or graphics in 10 years, so there’s basically no way for Half Life 3 to surprise us. Dishonored 1 and 2 were basically identical. If you told me the second one came out immediately after, I’d believe you.
Yeah, thats fair, I’m not trying to personally say HL2 is literally perfect, and I don’t think Valve are either…
But they’re saying that, by the time people really really wanted Half Life 3… they knew they would have to do something so revolutionary, so much better, to top it… that it actually wasn’t possible.
So, think outside the box, innovate elsewhere, all the other shit they’ve done?
Conceptually and practically easier than making a sequel that would live up to HL3 expectations.
Although, there are apparently reports/rumors that they are now actually trying to do HL3.
But that has been the case for almost two decades.
… these things, they take time.
A bit of a tangent, but tbh I feel like Half-Life Alyx was a perfect example of where they can take the franchise, but being a PC VR title (and one that really leans heavily into the tech and loses a ton if played with non-VR mods), it didn’t have nearly the same impact as the rest of the franchise. It was definitely innovative but not in a way to appeal to the mass market. Not to mention it sets the stage for HL3 even more than Ep 2 did.
100% agree!
Its an outstanding achievement… but it just ain’t affordable, ain’t accessible, not unless they can somehow get a Steam Frame to be more like half the cost of an Index, as opposed to about the same price.
On the other hand…
It would maybe be neat if more just games in general were made with the idea of a/many VR player(s) vs a/many kb+m or controller players.
Make asymetrical gameplay that plays to the strenghts of each set up.
Remember Splinter Cell’s old vs mode?
Two FPS heavies vs two TPS sneakybois?
Something like that, but specialized to different control set ups.
Actually balance around different control schemes, but where each control scheme basically is a base player class, something like that.
There are a few games and modes for games that do something like this, but nothing I am aware of thats like… a whole ass game, not just basically a minigame.
The Thief vibes were stellar in Dishonored, I liked it more than Dishonored 2 to be honest! Dishonored had the right amount of stealthy gameplay, places you could hide easily without too much issue. I succeeded most levels as a ghost or with few kills, solid stealth gameplay!
Maybe try the Styx games? They’re on sale quite regularly. I liked the first one a lot!
Dishonored (1) is my favorite game of all time. I’ve put in so many hours across every console I’ve owned since it came out in 2012. Some of the best DLC story expansions of all time, too. Glad to see it still getting some love and mourning the fact that we’ll never get another game.
Raphael Colantonio, the creative mind behind Dishonored, has started a new studio! Here’s an article about their next game
Wow that looks like a blast. I just finished my ~fifth playthrough of Bioshock: Infinite last week and that game looks like it would slot in right beside that. Thanks for sharing!
Ive played a lot of similar games and other games since it came out. I still think about this game.
One of my favorite trophies to get was the no kill run on the first dishonored. A lot of fun finding all the different ways to be a ghost. Though I wish they had more stealth magic, most of the stuff was combat based if I remember correctly
Dishonored is my favorite video game series of all time! I play that thing every year, lol. Love the stealth challenges and all the ways you can approach things. I really enjoy the sequels too, and this year I’ve finally gotten into the books. Fantastic game. Also they leaned heavy into the style, so 13 years later it still looks decent. Not nearly as aged-looking as “realistic” graphics from that time. Those still look decent too, all things considered. But stylized graphics tend to fit their current limitations better than pushing for realism.
THERE ARE BOOKS!?
And a few comics!
Novels
Dishonored: The Corroded Man
This takes place about a year before Dishonored 2, and POV characters include Emily and Corvo. I really liked this one. Especially how it expanded on the relationship between Corvo and Emily. Some neat character insights too. Emily is canonically a beefcake.Dishonored: The Return of Daud
This one follows Daud during the events of Dishonored 2 as he looks for the Twin-bladed Knife. Really cool concept that is once again brought down by Daud and his Daud-ness. “Woe is me, I killed the empress! Who can I push this blame upon to heal the hole in my black heart?!”. I’m making my way through though. It does show a bit more of Gristol that is outside of Dunwall.Dishonored: The Veiled Terror
I haven’t gotten here yet. It follows Billy Lurk after Death of the Outsider, and how she deals with the consequences of the ending of that game.Comics
I have not read these at all yet, and they may be hard to find.
Dishonored: The Wyrmwood Deciet
Dishonored: The Peeress and the Price
There may be more, but those are the only ones I’ve heard of.
Damn, I should really go back and play this. Bet it runs great on Steam Deck too!
That’s a great idea. Lemme add that to the queue. Right after I finish Hades 2 and baldur’s gate, and expedition 33 and…
Played dishonored 1 and 2 earlier this year on my steam deck and they played great. Also FYI - month ago I grabbed expedition 33 and started it - as someone who loved ff turn based games and baldur’s gate and turn based pathfinder, I found it extremely boring. Quit playing after forcing myself to continue for 15 hours thinking it would get better.
Probably just me, but maybe look into it more before making the buy.
Hey, those are on my list too!
When I played the Dishonored series I had massive Thief vibes, I loved it! I looted everything and I killed no one, and it felt like good old times.
Reminds me, time to play them again!
That game is insane. Like, I played the game with a non-legal route because of the good ending and stuff. But after I finished the game, I wondered how other people played this game, and holy shit, we are playing different games lol. This game is very gorey I don’t even know it’s part of the core gameplay lol
Dude it’s a blast. When they came out I played through each Dishonored once slowly, methodically, and non-lethal. Then immediately started over and hauled ass just slaughtering anything that got in my way. Both ways are valid and so much fun!
I’ll honestly never understand the appeal of non-lethal playthroughs.
Yeah, it barely takes more skill and you can brag to your friends or whatever, but a huge appeal of violent games is actually killing people.
This isn’t just a violent game. It’s an immersive sim. The fun comes from the many different ways you can handle a level. Even in ways unintended to the developer. Not every game is Gears of War.
This isn’t just a violent game.
😂
I mean, it really isn’t though. You can totally play it that way, yeah, but that’s only one option. The story reacts to how you play and the decisions you make. I find the low chaos (less or non-lethal) ending to be my favorite. Also canonically Corvo isn’t a raving lunatic murderer, so if you’re looking for the “True” story experience that’s the way to go. He still kills some people, notably the Lord Regent, but spares others.
To some the increased challenge is worth more than triggering kill animations
In Dishonored’s case, going all murderhobo gives you a bad ending, so there’s that too.
Not every game is Doom, sometimes being creative is the most fun part of the game
Its a very solid heir to Thief.
Just a damn good game.
